Discussion:
No such thing as a dry county.
(too old to reply)
(David P.)
2009-09-29 06:06:38 UTC
Permalink
http://bit.ly/14hdgZ
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%
2009-09-29 06:11:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by (David P.)
http://bit.ly/14hdgZ
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hi
David P.
2009-09-30 04:22:10 UTC
Permalink
Post by (David P.)
http://bit.ly/14hdgZ
This advertisement appeared in the Nov. 8, 1954
edition of the Charlotte Observer, sponsored by the
North Carolina Distributors of Malt Beverages.
Why dey do dat?
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David P.
2009-10-02 04:39:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by David P.
Post by (David P.)
http://bit.ly/14hdgZ
This advertisement appeared in the Nov. 8, 1954
edition of the Charlotte Observer, sponsored by the
North Carolina Distributors of Malt Beverages.
Why dey do dat?
Hey, I found out why!
Here's a map and an ad from 1961:

Loading Image...

Loading Image...
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bitchcakes
2009-10-02 05:17:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by David P.
Post by David P.
Post by (David P.)
http://bit.ly/14hdgZ
This advertisement appeared in the Nov. 8, 1954
edition of the Charlotte Observer, sponsored by the
North Carolina Distributors of Malt Beverages.
Why dey do dat?
Hey, I found out why!
http://imagehost.vendio.com/a/30377179/aview/1961-nc.JPG
http://imagehost.vendio.com/a/30377179/aview/1961-nc1.JPG
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Do dry-counties still exist? wow... I could not tolerate that.
David P.
2009-10-02 09:43:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by bitchcakes
Post by David P.
Post by David P.
Post by (David P.)
http://bit.ly/14hdgZ
This advertisement appeared in the Nov. 8, 1954
edition of the Charlotte Observer, sponsored by the
North Carolina Distributors of Malt Beverages.
Why dey do dat?
Hey, I found out why!
http://imagehost.vendio.com/a/30377179/aview/1961-nc.JPG
http://imagehost.vendio.com/a/30377179/aview/1961-nc1.JPG
Do dry-counties still exist? wow... I could not tolerate that.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dry_county
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Scott Dorsey
2009-10-02 13:58:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by David P.
Post by (David P.)
http://bit.ly/14hdgZ
This advertisement appeared in the Nov. 8, 1954
edition of the Charlotte Observer, sponsored by the
North Carolina Distributors of Malt Beverages.
Why dey do dat?
You have to admit that distributors of malt beverages are not exactly
disinterested parties on the subject of prohibition.

I bet if you talked to the bootleggers they would have a very different
take on the matter.
--scott
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"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
David P.
2009-10-02 16:44:10 UTC
Permalink
In talk.bizarre,
Post by Scott Dorsey
Post by David P.
Post by (David P.)
http://bit.ly/14hdgZ
This advertisement appeared in the Nov. 8, 1954
edition of the Charlotte Observer, sponsored by the
North Carolina Distributors of Malt Beverages.
Why dey do dat?
Hey, I found out why!
http://imagehost.vendio.com/a/30377179/aview/1961-nc.JPG
http://imagehost.vendio.com/a/30377179/aview/1961-nc1.JPG
You have to admit that distributors of malt beverages are not
exactly disinterested parties on the subject of prohibition.
I bet if you talked to the bootleggers they would have a very
different take on the matter.
From the same info booklet:
Raleigh Times, June 9, 1960
"Poison Booze War Opened"

The North Carolina State Board of Health has turned
"Revenuer" and is launching a statewide campaign
against the consumption of "white lightning".

To aid in the crack-down, gory posters will be
erected all over the state.

Loading Image...

Chemists with the State Bureau of Investigation
say there has been a decided increase in deaths
that can be attributed to the drinking of illegal
whiskey.

Within the past two or three years, there has been
a change in the method of manufacturing the whiskey.
Previously, copper or wooden stills were used, but
because of expense, galvanized metal stills have
replaced the older types. The lead soldering used
on the galvanized metal deposits lead salts in the
whiskey, and death from lead poisoning results.

The SBI has been testing whiskey and has found only
10 to 15 per cent to be lead-free. In Winston-Salem
alone, there have been eight deaths and 26 serious
illnesses definitely attributed to lead poisoning
from illegal whiskey.

The SBI chemists think that there are numerous deaths
from whiskey poisoning that are not recognized as
such. Lead salts can & do kill human cells directly,
but death also results from secondary organic dis-
functions caused by lead in the system. Anemia,
hardening of the arteries, and "painters' colic" all
may result from lead poisoning.

A person may consume enough lead at one time to kill
him (about one ounce), or the poisoning may result
after a long period of time. Death results when the
amount of lead consumed exceeds the amount excreted.
A person may have just enough lead in his system for
one more small dose to upset the balance and cause
almost instant death.
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Scott Dorsey
2009-10-02 18:05:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by David P.
Within the past two or three years, there has been
a change in the method of manufacturing the whiskey.
Previously, copper or wooden stills were used, but
because of expense, galvanized metal stills have
replaced the older types. The lead soldering used
on the galvanized metal deposits lead salts in the
whiskey, and death from lead poisoning results.
This was written by someone who clearly has never seen a still, and
who has never actually tried to solder a joint on galvanized steel.

Wooden stills?
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
Dan
2009-10-02 18:13:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by Scott Dorsey
Post by David P.
Within the past two or three years, there has been
a change in the method of manufacturing the whiskey.
Previously, copper or wooden stills were used, but
because of expense, galvanized metal stills have
replaced the older types. The lead soldering used
on the galvanized metal deposits lead salts in the
whiskey, and death from lead poisoning results.
This was written by someone who clearly has never seen a still, and
who has never actually tried to solder a joint on galvanized steel.
Wooden stills?
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
I'm not sure how this showed up in this ng. I agree with Scott. The still
can't be made of wood because it has to be heated to extract the alcohol.
Yes, soldering steel would be a large problem. I think drinking enough
whiskey to get lead poisoning would have killed you long before from the
alcohol consumption.

Why am I answering this anyway? Nothing better to do, I guess.

Dan
David P.
2009-10-02 19:03:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by Scott Dorsey
Post by David P.
Within the past two or three years, there has been
a change in the method of manufacturing the whiskey.
Previously, copper or wooden stills were used, but
because of expense, galvanized metal stills have
replaced the older types.  The lead soldering used
on the galvanized metal deposits lead salts in the
whiskey, and death from lead poisoning results.
This was written by someone who clearly has never seen a still, and
who has never actually tried to solder a joint on galvanized steel.
Wooden stills?
Results 1-10 of ~1,110 for "wooden stills". (0.35 sec)

1) http://www.pussers.com/rum/difference

2) http://www.ministryofrum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=939

[...]
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sid
2009-10-02 21:43:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by David P.
Post by Scott Dorsey
Post by David P.
Within the past two or three years, there has been
a change in the method of manufacturing the whiskey.
Previously, copper or wooden stills were used, but
because of expense, galvanized metal stills have
replaced the older types. The lead soldering used
on the galvanized metal deposits lead salts in the
whiskey, and death from lead poisoning results.
This was written by someone who clearly has never seen a still, and
who has never actually tried to solder a joint on galvanized steel.
Wooden stills?
Results 1-10 of ~1,110 for "wooden stills". (0.35 sec)
1) http://www.pussers.com/rum/difference
2) http://www.ministryofrum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=939
[...]
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... mot with dave srUND, NO

sig
(David P.)
2009-10-31 04:26:16 UTC
Permalink
In alt.recovery.aa,
Post by David P.
Within the past 2-3 years, there has been a change in
the method of mfg. the whiskey. Previously, copper or
wooden stills were used, but because of $$, galvanized
metal stills replaced older types. The lead soldering
used on the galv. metal deposits lead salts in whiskey,
and death from lead poisoning results.
written by someone who clearly never seen a still, &
who never actually tried to solder a joint on galvanized
steel. Wooden stills?
Results 1-10 of ~1,110 for "wooden stills". (0.35 sec)
1) http://www.pussers.com/rum/difference
Yeah, ya gits yer mash tew hot 'r boils it, yew gits a
scorched taste to yer spirits. So wood is gud so long as
yew don't pass out or fall 'sleep while yer tenden yer
still 'nd let fire flare up 'r let yer pot git tew hot 'r
empty 'nd dry. Kind of like boiling water in paper cup.
Long as cup got water in it' 'tain't gonna ketch on fire
wiff normal heating flames. Jest my experience now yew
unnerstands. Other's mileage may vary.

Now on soldering iron/steel pipe, particularly galvanized?
It hell to even weld 'nd if yew don't takes lot of
precautions with the galvanized stuff when using oxy-
acetylene as far as not breathing the fumes, it kinda make
ya bonkers in a bit. Puke lot tew, it did me. But I luvs to
sweat copper. ;-)

All most as much as I *used* to likes to distill spirits
'r dabble wiff zymurgy or the vintner's arts.

Remnd me to tell yew my Lil Ole Winemaker me story sum
day. Or if you curious you kin Google for it. ;-)

CC

PS: http://tinyurl.com/ychzurn
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nikolai kingsley
2009-10-02 19:48:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by Scott Dorsey
Wooden stills?
could you cast one out of ceramic?

i can see brandy named "little pig".
Gary Heston
2009-10-03 00:52:55 UTC
Permalink
Post by nikolai kingsley
Post by Scott Dorsey
Wooden stills?
Maybe made from ironwood...
Post by nikolai kingsley
could you cast one out of ceramic?
Actually, some early stills were made from ceramic or earthenware. They
used a cone-shaped piece that sat point up over a pot, and had a lip at
the bottom that curled inward and had a spout in it at a low point. The
interior of the cone was glazed to reduce absorption into the cone.

Not the most efficient, but better than nothing.
Post by nikolai kingsley
i can see brandy named "little pig".
Or "conehead".


Gary
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Gary Heston ***@hiwaay.net http://www.thebreastcancersite.com/
"Where large, expensive pieces of exotic woods are converted to valueless,
hard to dispose of sawdust, chips and scraps." Charlie B.s' definition of
woodworking.
David P.
2009-09-30 04:22:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by (David P.)
http://bit.ly/14hdgZ
Prohibition in the United States

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

In the history of the U.S., Prohibition, also known
as The Noble Experiment, is the period from 1919 to
1933, during which the sale, manufacture, and trans-
portation of alcohol for consumption were banned
nationally as mandated in the Eighteenth Amendment
to the United States Constitution.

Under substantial pressure from the temperance movement,
the United States Senate proposed the 18th Amendment
on December 18, 1917. Having been approved by 36 states,
the 18th Amendment was ratified on January 16, 1919 and
effected on January 16, 1920. Some state legislatures
had already enacted statewide prohibition prior to the
ratification.

The "Volstead Act", the popular name for the National
Prohibition Act, passed through Congress over President
Woodrow Wilson's veto on October 28, 1919 & established
the legal definition of intoxicating liquor. Though the
Volstead Act prohibited the sale of alcohol, it did
little to enforce the law. The illegal production and
distribution of liquor, or bootlegging, became rampant,
and the national government did not have the means or
desire to enforce every border/lake/river/speakeasy in
America. In fact, by 1925 in New York City alone there
were anywhere from 30,000 to 100,000 speakeasy clubs.

Prohibition became increasingly unpopular during the
Great Depression, especially in large cities. On March
23, 1933, President Franklin Roosevelt signed into law
an amendment to the Volstead Act known as the Cullen-
Harrison Act, allowing the manufacture and sale of
certain kinds of alcoholic beverages.

On Dec. 5, 1933, the ratification of the 21st Amendment
repealed the Eighteenth Amendment.

History
Origins

In May of 1657, the General Court of Massachusetts made
illegal the sale of strong liquor “whether known by the
name of rumme, strong water, wine, brandy, etc.”

In general, informal social controls in the home and
community helped maintain the expectation that the
abuse of alcohol was unacceptable. There was a clear
consensus that while alcohol was a gift from God, its
abuse was from the Devil. "Drunkenness was condemned
and punished, but only as an abuse of a God-given gift.
Drink itself was not looked upon as culpable, any more
than food deserved blame for the sin of gluttony. Excess
was a personal indiscretion." When informal controls
failed, there were always legal ones.

Explanation was sought by medical men. One suggestion
had come from one of the foremost physicians of the late
18th c., Dr. Benjamin Rush. In 1784, he argued that the
excessive use of alcohol was injurious to physical &
psychological health (he believed in moderation rather
than prohibition). Apparently influenced by Rush's widely
discussed belief, about 200 farmers in a Connecticut
community formed a temperance association in 1789.
Similar associations were formed in Virginia in 1800
and New York in 1808. Within the next decade, other
temperance organizations were formed in eight states,
some being statewide organizations.

Development of the Prohibition movement

The prohibition, or "dry", movement began in the 1840s,
spearheaded by pietistic religious denominations, espec-
ially the Methodists. The late 1800s saw the temperance
movement broaden its focus from abstinence to all
behavior & institutions related to alcohol consumption.
Preachers such as Rev. Mark A. Matthews linked liquor-
dispensing saloons with prostitution.

Some successes were registered in the 1850s, including
Maine's total ban on the manufacture & sale of liquor,
adopted in 1851. However, the movement lost strength,
and was marginalized during the Civil War.

The issue was revived by Prohibition Party, founded in
1869, & the Woman's Christian Temperance Union, founded
in 1873. Despite its name, the latter group did not
promote moderation or temperance but rather prohibition
of alcohol. One of its methods to achieve that goal was
education. It was believed that if it could "get to the
children" it could create a "dry" sentiment leading to
prohibition. (Supporters of prohibition were nicknamed
"Dry"; opponents were called "Wet".)

In 1881, Kansas became the 1st state to outlaw alcoholic
beverages in its Constitution, with Carrie Nation
gaining notoriety for enforcing the provision herself
by walking into saloons, scolding customers, and using
her hatchet to destroy bottles of liquor. Nation
recruited ladies as The Carry Nation Prohibition Group
which Nation also led. Other activists enforced the
cause by entering saloons, singing, praying, and urging
saloon keepers to stop selling alcohol. Many other
states, especially in the South, also enacted prohibition,
along with many individual counties.

In the Progressive Era (1890-1920), hostility to saloons
and their political influence became widespread, with
the Anti-Saloon League superseding the Prohibition Party
and the Woman's Christian Temperance Union as the most
influential advocate of prohibition.

Prohibition was an important force in state/local politics
from the 1840s through the 1930s. The political forces
involved were ethnoreligious in character, as demonstrated
by numerous historical studies. Prohibition was demanded by
the "dries" — primarily pietistic Protestant denominations,
especially the Methodists, Northern Baptists, Southern
Baptists, Presbyterians, Disciples of Christ, Congregation-
alists, Quakers, & Scandinavian Lutherans. They identified
saloons as politically corrupt and drinking as a personal
sin. They were opposed by the "wets" — primarily liturgical
Protestants (Episcopalians, German Lutherans) and Roman
Catholics, who denounced the idea that the government
should define morality. Even in the wet stronghold of
New York City there was an active prohibition movement,
led by Norwegian church groups and African-American labor
activists who believed that Prohibition would benefit
workers, especially African-Americans. Tea merchants and
soda fountain manufacturers generally supported Prohibition,
thinking a ban on alcohol would increase sales of their
products.

In the 1916 presidential election, both Dem. incumbent
Woodrow Wilson & Rep. candidate Charles Evans Hughes
ignored the Prohibition issue, as was the case with
both parties' political platforms. Dems and Reps had
strong wet & dry factions, & the election was expected
to be close, with neither candidate wanting to alienate
any part of his political base.

In January 1917, the 65th Congress convened, in which
the dries outnumbered the wets by 140 to 64 in the
Democratic party and 138 to 62 among Republicans. With
America's declaration of war against Germany in April,
German-Americans—a major force against prohibition—were
widely discredited and their protests subsequently
ignored.

A resolution calling for an amendment to accomplish
nationwide Prohibition was introduced in Congress and
passed by both houses in December 1917. On January 16,
1919, the Amendment was ratified by thirty-six of the
forty-eight states. On October 28, 1919, the amendment
was supplemented by the Volstead Act. Prohibition began
on January 16, 1920, when the Eighteenth Amendment went
into effect. 1,520 Federal Prohibition agents (police)
were given the task of enforcing the law.

Although it was highly controversial, Prohibition was
widely supported by diverse groups. Progressives
believed that it would improve society & the Ku Klux
Klan strongly supported its strict enforcement as
generally did women, southerners, those living in
rural areas and African-Americans. There were a few
exceptions such as the Woman’s Organization for
Prohibition Reform who fought against it. Will Rogers
often joked about the southern pro-prohibitionists:
"The South is dry & will vote dry. That is, everybody
sober enough to stagger to the polls." Supporters of
the Amendment soon became quite confident that it would
not be repealed, to the point that one of its creators,
Senator Morris Sheppard, joked that "there is as much
chance of repealing the Eighteenth Amendment as there
is for a humming-bird to fly to the planet Mars with
the Washington Monument tied to its tail."

The issue of Prohibition became a highly controversial
one among medical professionals, because alcohol was
widely prescribed by physicians of the era for thera-
peutic purposes. Congress held hearings on the medicinal
value of beer in 1921. Subsequently, physicians across
the country lobbied for the repeal of Prohibition as it
applied to medicinal liquors.

While the manufacture, sale, and transport of alcohol
was illegal in the U.S., Section 29 of the Volstead Act
allowed the making at home of wine & cider from fruit
(but not beer). Up to 200 gallons/year could be made,
and some vineyards grew grapes for home use. Also, one
anomaly of the Act as worded was that it did not
actually prohibit the consumption of alcohol; many
people actually stockpiled wines & liquors for their
own use in the latter part of 1919 before sales of
alcohol became illegal the following January.

Alcoholic drinks were not illegal in surrounding
countries. Distilleries & breweries in Canada, Mexico,
and the Caribbean flourished as their products were
either consumed by visiting Americans or illegally
imported to the U.S. Chicago became notorious as a
haven for Prohibition dodgers during the time known
as the Roaring Twenties. Many of Chicago's most
notorious gangsters, including Al Capone and his
enemy Bugs Moran, made millions of dollars through
illegal alcohol sales. By the end of the decade Capone
controlled all 10,000 speakeasies in Chicago and ruled
the bootlegging business from Canada to Florida.
Numerous other crimes, including theft and murder,
were directly linked to criminal activities in Chicago
and elsewhere in violation of prohibition.

Repeal

As Prohibition became increasingly unpopular, esp. in
the big cities, "Repeal" was eagerly anticipated. On
March 23, 1933, President Franklin Roosevelt signed
an amendment to the Volstead Act known as the Cullen-
Harrison Act, allowing the manufacture and sale of
"3.2 beer" (3.2% alcohol by weight, approx. 4% alcohol
by vol.) & light wines. The original Volstead Act had
defined "intoxicating beverage" as one with greater
than 0.5% alcohol. Upon signing the amendment, FDR
made his famous remark; "I think this would be a good
time for a beer." The Cullen-Harrison Act became law on
April 7, 1933. The Eighteenth Amendment was repealed on
December 5, 1933 with ratification of the Twenty-first
Amendment. Despite the efforts of Heber J. Grant and
the LDS Church, a Utah convention helped ratify the
21st Amendment. While Utah can be considered the
deciding 36th state to ratify the Amendment and make
it law, the day Utah passed the Amendment, both
Pennsylvania and Ohio passed it as well.

The Twenty-first Amendment explicitly gives states
the right to restrict or ban the purchase or sale of
alcohol; this has led to a patchwork of laws, in which
alcohol may be legally sold in some but not all towns
or counties within a particular state. After the repeal
of the national constitutional amendment, some states
continued to enforce prohibition laws. Mississippi,
which had made alcohol illegal in 1907, was the last
state to repeal Prohibition, in 1966. Kansas did not
allow sale of liquor "by the drink" (on-premises) until
1987. There are numerous "dry" counties or towns where
no liquor is sold, even though liquor can often be
brought in for private consumption.

Society

Many social problems have been attributed to the
Prohibition era. Mafia groups limited their activities
to gambling and thievery until 1920, when organized
bootlegging manifested in response to the effect of
Prohibition. A profitable, often violent, black market
for alcohol flourished. Powerful gangs corrupted law
enforcement agencies, leading to Racketeering. Stronger
liquor surged in popularity because its potency made it
more profitable to smuggle.

The cost of enforcing Prohibition was high, & the lack
of tax revenues on alcohol (some $500 million annually
nationwide) affected government coffers.

When repeal of Prohibition occurred in 1933, organized
crime lost nearly all of its black market alcohol
profits in most states (states still had the right to
enforce their own laws concerning alcohol consumption)
because of competition with low-priced alcohol sales at
legal liquor stores.

Prohibition had a notable effect on the alcohol brewing
industry in the United States. When Prohibition ended,
only half the breweries that had previously existed
reopened. The post-Prohibition period saw the intro-
duction of the American lager style of beer, which
dominates today. Wine historians also note that Pro-
hibition destroyed what was a fledgling wine industry
in the United States. Productive wine quality grape
vines were replaced by lower quality vines growing
thicker skinned grapes that could be more easily
transported. Much of the institutional knowledge was
also lost as winemakers either emigrated to other wine
producing countries or left the business altogether.

At the end of Prohibition, some supporters openly
admitted its failure. A quote from a letter, written
in 1932 by wealthy industrialist John D. Rockefeller,
Jr., states:

"When Prohibition was introduced, I hoped that it
would be widely supported by public opinion and the
day would soon come when the evil effects of alcohol
would be recognized. I have slowly and reluctantly
come to believe that this has not been the result.
Instead, drinking has generally increased; the speak-
easy has replaced the saloon; a vast army of law-
breakers has appeared; many of our best citizens have
openly ignored Prohibition; respect for the law has
been greatly lessened; and crime has increased to a
level never seen before."

Some historians have commented that the alcohol
industry accepted stronger regulation of alcohol
in the decades after repeal, as a way to reduce the
chance that Prohibition would return.

Winemaking during Prohibition

During Prohibition, large numbers of people began
making their own alcoholic beverages at home. To do
so, they often used bricks of wine, sometimes called
blocks of wine. To meet the booming demand for grape
juice, California grape growers increased their area
about 700% in the first five years of prohibition.
The juice was commonly sold as "bricks or blocks of
Rhine Wine," "blocks of port," and so on along with
a warning: "After dissolving the brick in a gallon
of water, do not place the liquid in a jug away in
the cupboard for twenty days, because then it would
turn into wine." One grape block producer sold nine
varieties: Port, Virginia Dare, Muscatel, Angelica,
Tokay, Sauterne, Riesling, Claret and Burgundy.
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